Vaughn Tolle said:
To correct a possible misperception concerning the offspring, there were times when Mom or Dad should have been asked to proof a paper.
Example: younger writing an essay for Freshman English. She "invented" a word, "thusfore"; if she would have requested parental proofing, this highly unusual usage would have been caught, and a change recommended (along with encouraging a reference to a dictionary) before submission of the same. Her English teacher quite correctly noted the non-word, which caused her to not receive the perfect grade to which she aspired, much to her dismay. It didn't change anything as to parental proofreading, but did result in closer consultation with a dictionary and thesaurus in the future, and for that, we were grateful.
Example: younger writing an essay for Freshman English. She "invented" a word, "thusfore"; if she would have requested parental proofing, this highly unusual usage would have been caught, and a change recommended (along with encouraging a reference to a dictionary) before submission of the same. Her English teacher quite correctly noted the non-word, which caused her to not receive the perfect grade to which she aspired, much to her dismay. It didn't change anything as to parental proofreading, but did result in closer consultation with a dictionary and thesaurus in the future, and for that, we were grateful.
WSClark said:
Good morning to y'all. As uncalled for as usual, some random thoughts......
I just chased of the JW canvassers off my porch. I appreciate any one's faith, but what is just with the door to door stuff? I am always polite, but firm when I tell them that I am not interested. Anyway, I feel bad (a little) for shutting them off, but I just find it a little off putting that they go door to door.
The deabte last night - I watched and read the viewers poll last night. I thought and a majority of viewers thought that Obama had "won" but the commentators were unanimous is saying that Hillary was a clear winner. Huh?
I don't participate in conspiracy theories, but this seems like the media is anointing Mrs. Clinton the front runner and they are going to stick to that story.
It's way too early to really make a call, but I am going to be watching this closely. It's not that I am anti-Hillary, but eighteen months before the election is too early to declare a victor.
Here's one that falls under the the category of "jeez, WHO didn't know that?"
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18348452/
"Former CIA Director George Tenet writes in a new book that Vice President Dick Cheney and other administration officials pushed the country to invade Iraq without a "serious debate" about whether Saddam Hussein was an imminent threat."
Off to do my errands - see you all later......
I just chased of the JW canvassers off my porch. I appreciate any one's faith, but what is just with the door to door stuff? I am always polite, but firm when I tell them that I am not interested. Anyway, I feel bad (a little) for shutting them off, but I just find it a little off putting that they go door to door.
The deabte last night - I watched and read the viewers poll last night. I thought and a majority of viewers thought that Obama had "won" but the commentators were unanimous is saying that Hillary was a clear winner. Huh?
I don't participate in conspiracy theories, but this seems like the media is anointing Mrs. Clinton the front runner and they are going to stick to that story.
It's way too early to really make a call, but I am going to be watching this closely. It's not that I am anti-Hillary, but eighteen months before the election is too early to declare a victor.
Here's one that falls under the the category of "jeez, WHO didn't know that?"
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18348452/
"Former CIA Director George Tenet writes in a new book that Vice President Dick Cheney and other administration officials pushed the country to invade Iraq without a "serious debate" about whether Saddam Hussein was an imminent threat."
Off to do my errands - see you all later......
lindainks55 said:
Another article I found interesting about George Tenet's book, "At the Center of the Storm."
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/04/27/news/tenet....
I'm looking forward to the squirming. Let the excuses begin. It's almost gotten funny and they have so many directions to turn in their excusing and attempting to defend the illogical and corrupt.
You know Vaughn, because I've told you, although I've never met your daughters I feel proud of them when you tell us about their accomplishments! And, I'm proud of you, their Father, who just busts his buttons. It's the way a Father should feel. Makes me feel good to know about the people who will be our tomorrow!
I had the same visitors at my door this morning, Will. Either we live close or there was a get out the JW effort going on this morning. I politely told them I wasn't interested and they politely thanked me, turned and went to the next house. Took a couple seconds. There have been encounters in the past not as pleasant or polite so I didn't mind this one.
We have sewer problems here. Yuck, is there anything worse!? It's an old neighborhood, with lots of big trees, lots of problems with tree roots. Wayne was going to try to get away early this afternoon and tackle the problem. MOST embarrassing moment of the morning -- the young man with Dish Network asked to use my bathroom. YUCK! It hadn't been flushed and I had to explain. grumble, gripe, hanging head and blushing all over again, slinking off in embarrassment.
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/04/27/news/tenet....
I'm looking forward to the squirming. Let the excuses begin. It's almost gotten funny and they have so many directions to turn in their excusing and attempting to defend the illogical and corrupt.
You know Vaughn, because I've told you, although I've never met your daughters I feel proud of them when you tell us about their accomplishments! And, I'm proud of you, their Father, who just busts his buttons. It's the way a Father should feel. Makes me feel good to know about the people who will be our tomorrow!
I had the same visitors at my door this morning, Will. Either we live close or there was a get out the JW effort going on this morning. I politely told them I wasn't interested and they politely thanked me, turned and went to the next house. Took a couple seconds. There have been encounters in the past not as pleasant or polite so I didn't mind this one.
We have sewer problems here. Yuck, is there anything worse!? It's an old neighborhood, with lots of big trees, lots of problems with tree roots. Wayne was going to try to get away early this afternoon and tackle the problem. MOST embarrassing moment of the morning -- the young man with Dish Network asked to use my bathroom. YUCK! It hadn't been flushed and I had to explain. grumble, gripe, hanging head and blushing all over again, slinking off in embarrassment.
Gster said:
Linda- So , as I see it, the choice was TV or running water. How about Door #3?
That's a brutal game you're playing!
That's a brutal game you're playing!
lindainks55 said:
Here's something coming up May 9th that should prove interesting. Several of the mass-fired attorneys are getting together. McKay, the ousted U.S. attorney for the Western District of Washington, is now a visiting professor at the Seattle University School of Law. On May 9 he's hosting a pair of his fellow fired federal prosecutors for a forum on the mass sackings last year.
Joining McKay will be David C. Iglesias, the former U.S. attorney for New Mexico, and Paul K. Charlton, the former prosecutor for Arizona. McKay, Iglesias and Charlton are three of the most controversial firings of the eight ousted prosecutors, because they were either conducting sensitive investigations of Republicans or under fire for not prosecuting Democrats around the time of their dismissals on Dec. 7.
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/capitol-briefing/20...
Joining McKay will be David C. Iglesias, the former U.S. attorney for New Mexico, and Paul K. Charlton, the former prosecutor for Arizona. McKay, Iglesias and Charlton are three of the most controversial firings of the eight ousted prosecutors, because they were either conducting sensitive investigations of Republicans or under fire for not prosecuting Democrats around the time of their dismissals on Dec. 7.
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/capitol-briefing/20...
tracyaphillips said:
SMU: Blatantly and Unequivocally False
The push back from the Discovery Institute's Darwin vs. Design tent revival and patent medicine show at SMU continues. Dr. John Wise and Dr. Pia Vogel write in the SMU Daily Campus:
Jonathon Wells, a Discovery Institute fellow, Philipp Johnson and other ID and creationism proponents have asserted that there is no evidence of transitional intermediates between species in the fossil record and have inferred from this that a creator must have intervened. Their assertion is blatantly and unequivocally false. It's rock for goodness' sake. It's hard to ignore tons of rock with whale-like tetrapods, tetrapod-like whales, reptile-like birds, bird-like reptiles, fish with arm bones, and the many other transitional forms found in them over and over again without losing credibility.
Of course, if you believe, as Wells does, that the Rev. Sun Myung Moon is Christ's heir, and that buying Moonie trinkets can make life easier in the afterlife for those who have already died, ignoring a few tons of rock isn't really that difficult.
# posted by Red State Rabble @ 5:39 AM
The push back from the Discovery Institute's Darwin vs. Design tent revival and patent medicine show at SMU continues. Dr. John Wise and Dr. Pia Vogel write in the SMU Daily Campus:
Jonathon Wells, a Discovery Institute fellow, Philipp Johnson and other ID and creationism proponents have asserted that there is no evidence of transitional intermediates between species in the fossil record and have inferred from this that a creator must have intervened. Their assertion is blatantly and unequivocally false. It's rock for goodness' sake. It's hard to ignore tons of rock with whale-like tetrapods, tetrapod-like whales, reptile-like birds, bird-like reptiles, fish with arm bones, and the many other transitional forms found in them over and over again without losing credibility.
Of course, if you believe, as Wells does, that the Rev. Sun Myung Moon is Christ's heir, and that buying Moonie trinkets can make life easier in the afterlife for those who have already died, ignoring a few tons of rock isn't really that difficult.
# posted by Red State Rabble @ 5:39 AM
Vaughn Tolle said:
From "The Sandbox", one soldier's description of his current life and duty in Baghdad.
http://gocomics.typepad.com/the_sandbox/2007/04/th...
http://gocomics.typepad.com/the_sandbox/2007/04/th...
lindainks55 said:
I know longhorn won't mind when I say, Jesus wept.
Me too.
Thousands of young men and women living the consequences of a war in Iraq that our government never should have waged and is not willing to end.
Me too.
Thousands of young men and women living the consequences of a war in Iraq that our government never should have waged and is not willing to end.
tracyaphillips said:
And the chickenhawks wanna shame us into staying there.
You know, genocide and all when we leave.
Why should that bother them, I can site time after time they have supported maniacal dictators and looked the other way.
Willful ignorance when it suits their purpose.
Of course that doesn't make it okay to do the same again, but it sure does seem that we are powerless to stop this centuries old fued.
And the thing about staying scared about the aftermath of leaving, well, how in the hell do stop anything? Sunni and shia will not heed our calls for civility, why would they?
In fact why would the Iraq govt do any more than give us lip service?
Hell, they didn't want us there.
Would the US govt cooperate with an occupying forces political wishes?
Would we, the population cooperate, even if the govt did?
What an extreme lack of empathy and imagination on or present admins part.
That's about as nicely as you can put it.
You know, genocide and all when we leave.
Why should that bother them, I can site time after time they have supported maniacal dictators and looked the other way.
Willful ignorance when it suits their purpose.
Of course that doesn't make it okay to do the same again, but it sure does seem that we are powerless to stop this centuries old fued.
And the thing about staying scared about the aftermath of leaving, well, how in the hell do stop anything? Sunni and shia will not heed our calls for civility, why would they?
In fact why would the Iraq govt do any more than give us lip service?
Hell, they didn't want us there.
Would the US govt cooperate with an occupying forces political wishes?
Would we, the population cooperate, even if the govt did?
What an extreme lack of empathy and imagination on or present admins part.
That's about as nicely as you can put it.
Vaughn Tolle said:
The linked blog post just goes to prove the continuing viability of General Sherman's observation about war.
Tracy, the current Iraqi government (albeit a lame duck government, I believe) most certainly wants the U.S. and other coalition members to remain; it's the only hope for its surviving.
Tracy, the current Iraqi government (albeit a lame duck government, I believe) most certainly wants the U.S. and other coalition members to remain; it's the only hope for its surviving.
lindainks55 said:
Hawkeye: "War isn't Hell. War is war, and Hell is Hell. And of the two, war is a lot worse."
Father Mulcahy: "Why do you say that, Hawkeye?"
Hawkeye: "Simple, Father. Tell me, who goes to Hell?"
Father Mulcahy: "Sinners, I believe."
Hawkeye: "Exactly. There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. War is full of them."
— from the TV series M*A*S*H
Father Mulcahy: "Why do you say that, Hawkeye?"
Hawkeye: "Simple, Father. Tell me, who goes to Hell?"
Father Mulcahy: "Sinners, I believe."
Hawkeye: "Exactly. There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. War is full of them."
— from the TV series M*A*S*H
lindainks55 said:
"Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding." — Albert Einstein
"War is only a cowardly escape from the problems of peace." — Thomas Mann
"An inglorious peace is better than a dishonorable war." — Mark Twain
more, many more at http://www.hickorytech.net/~leighp/warisstupid/page3.html
"War is only a cowardly escape from the problems of peace." — Thomas Mann
"An inglorious peace is better than a dishonorable war." — Mark Twain
more, many more at http://www.hickorytech.net/~leighp/warisstupid/page3.html
lindainks55 said:
I'm sorry! I don't have the right to tell you what to do. Although I am counting on you and Steve to learn some pretty music. Anyway, do what you do when you want how you want...
Did you know life is a painting we make and we don't get an eraser? Like that post above that is there forever and I don't get a do over...
Today I have helped man a big snake -- I've been on the roof feeding it into a pipe, I've been on the patio stepping on the foot feed and guiding it. What a mess. NOW we have not only running water but it goes where it should (which, btw, is NOT out the floor drain in the basement and all over the storage room floor). SUCCESS! I am now going to the shower and I think I need to spend some time scrubbing.
Did you know life is a painting we make and we don't get an eraser? Like that post above that is there forever and I don't get a do over...
Today I have helped man a big snake -- I've been on the roof feeding it into a pipe, I've been on the patio stepping on the foot feed and guiding it. What a mess. NOW we have not only running water but it goes where it should (which, btw, is NOT out the floor drain in the basement and all over the storage room floor). SUCCESS! I am now going to the shower and I think I need to spend some time scrubbing.
sunbefree said:
Thusfore I like. Mozilla has a built in dictionary and caught it. Therefore is a word and was not flagged by Mozilla.
I do my homework in Microsoft Word and it catches most of the stuff. I'm surprised this or some other software is not available in the Tolle household. (Tolle was flagged as incorrect, but added it to the dictionary.)
There is a wonderful program called "Open Office" that works on about any type of computer including Linux. It has powerful presentation software, Word Processor, Graphics, spreadsheet and database. Best of all, it is free!
======
War.
I stood near the babbling brook and watch it flow,
My brother has gone to defend, I watched him go.
My neighbors were enslaved and beaten with brutal whips of leather.
Still, I did not lift up my eyes, I did not care but for the weather.
They came for me, and I cried the loudest as they wrenched me from my family.
I did not defend my neighbor and no one has defended me.
War Poetry by sunbefree - "Reasons for War"
I do my homework in Microsoft Word and it catches most of the stuff. I'm surprised this or some other software is not available in the Tolle household. (Tolle was flagged as incorrect, but added it to the dictionary.)
There is a wonderful program called "Open Office" that works on about any type of computer including Linux. It has powerful presentation software, Word Processor, Graphics, spreadsheet and database. Best of all, it is free!
======
War.
I stood near the babbling brook and watch it flow,
My brother has gone to defend, I watched him go.
My neighbors were enslaved and beaten with brutal whips of leather.
Still, I did not lift up my eyes, I did not care but for the weather.
They came for me, and I cried the loudest as they wrenched me from my family.
I did not defend my neighbor and no one has defended me.
War Poetry by sunbefree - "Reasons for War"
Nathan said:
War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
John Stuart Mill
John Stuart Mill
Nathan said:
Never, never, never believe any war will be smooth and easy, or that anyone who embarks on the strange voyage can measure the tides and hurricanes he will encounter. The statesman who yields to war fever must realize that once the signal is given, he is no longer the master of policy but the slave of unforeseeable and uncontrollable events.
Sir Winston Churchill
Sir Winston Churchill
Nathan said:
Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.
Ronald Reagan
Ronald Reagan
Nathan said:
Except for ending slavery, fascism, nazim and communism, war has NEVER solved anything.
Nathan said:
Oh by the way,
Score another victory for concealed carry when the House and Senate overrode the governors veto of HB 2528!
So much for all the cities circumventing the original intent of the CCW law.
Score another victory for concealed carry when the House and Senate overrode the governors veto of HB 2528!
So much for all the cities circumventing the original intent of the CCW law.
Vaughn Tolle said:
Uh, Nathan, the word was "thusfore". I am using OO 2.x on my Linux box, and as you say, the best thing is that it's free!
lindainks55 said:
Morning everyone!
It looks like it will be one of those most-wonderful kind of weather days. Kansas gets those mixed in with the too windy, too hot, too cold so we need to try to enjoy them when they're here.
Vaughn, I talked to Wayne and will be calling you.
gster, you're a good sport! I'll try harder to remember not to insert unheeded advice (and worse, instructions). Hard to take the Mom out of a Mother/Grandmother, but still doesn't make it right! ;-)
As usual, the world of politics is, well -- full of politicians. IMO the worst kind of people to put in charge. The bunch we have at the top nationally are the worst I've seen in my 60 years. They'll go and we'll replace them with others who (hopefully) won't be quite as stupid, corrupt, and out of touch. (Believe me, I've tempered what I really think of this bunch with these words.) It's too bad accountability didn't start sooner in this administration, but they've got it now. I still contend he and his are the best ambassadors the Democratic Party has ever had. He gives all things Republican a bad name. Even many Republicans are aware of that. And then there are the bushbots who will never see beyond the end of their nose. Small and insignificant bunch so not to worry.
Boy did I sleep well after the physical fix the sewer problem day. Poor Wayne, he sure had lousy help (me). When will we ever decide to stop doing things ourselves and start hiring out some of it? Maybe we're not quite ready to admit we can't do it all any longer. Sigh.
Have any of you seen the ads my kids have run in the newspaper for their new business, Mindscapes? They have paying customers from those ads, and they don't officially open until June. They're off! Such good hard-working people. It's exciting and scary, but you can't succeed (or fail) without trying so I'm proud of them. I think they will succeed.
Off to start the day.
It looks like it will be one of those most-wonderful kind of weather days. Kansas gets those mixed in with the too windy, too hot, too cold so we need to try to enjoy them when they're here.
Vaughn, I talked to Wayne and will be calling you.
gster, you're a good sport! I'll try harder to remember not to insert unheeded advice (and worse, instructions). Hard to take the Mom out of a Mother/Grandmother, but still doesn't make it right! ;-)
As usual, the world of politics is, well -- full of politicians. IMO the worst kind of people to put in charge. The bunch we have at the top nationally are the worst I've seen in my 60 years. They'll go and we'll replace them with others who (hopefully) won't be quite as stupid, corrupt, and out of touch. (Believe me, I've tempered what I really think of this bunch with these words.) It's too bad accountability didn't start sooner in this administration, but they've got it now. I still contend he and his are the best ambassadors the Democratic Party has ever had. He gives all things Republican a bad name. Even many Republicans are aware of that. And then there are the bushbots who will never see beyond the end of their nose. Small and insignificant bunch so not to worry.
Boy did I sleep well after the physical fix the sewer problem day. Poor Wayne, he sure had lousy help (me). When will we ever decide to stop doing things ourselves and start hiring out some of it? Maybe we're not quite ready to admit we can't do it all any longer. Sigh.
Have any of you seen the ads my kids have run in the newspaper for their new business, Mindscapes? They have paying customers from those ads, and they don't officially open until June. They're off! Such good hard-working people. It's exciting and scary, but you can't succeed (or fail) without trying so I'm proud of them. I think they will succeed.
Off to start the day.
TRACY said:
"The Meek Shall Inherit the Earth's Beer Bottles"
When we were children after the war
we lived for a year in a house next
to a large highway. There were many
sawmills and log ponds on the otherside
of the highway. The sound of the saws could
be heard most of the time and when there
was darkness trash burners glowed red
against the sky. We did not have a father
and our mother had to work very hard.
My sister and I got our spending money
by gathering beer bottles that had been
thrown along the highway or left around
the sawmills. At first we carried the
bottles in gunny sacks and cardboard boxes
but later we found an old baby buggy
and we used that to carry our bottles in.
We took the bottles to a grocery store
and were paid a penny for small beer bottles
and two cents for large ones. On almost
any day we could be seen pushing our baby
buggy along the highway looking
for beer bottles.
~Brautigan
When we were children after the war
we lived for a year in a house next
to a large highway. There were many
sawmills and log ponds on the otherside
of the highway. The sound of the saws could
be heard most of the time and when there
was darkness trash burners glowed red
against the sky. We did not have a father
and our mother had to work very hard.
My sister and I got our spending money
by gathering beer bottles that had been
thrown along the highway or left around
the sawmills. At first we carried the
bottles in gunny sacks and cardboard boxes
but later we found an old baby buggy
and we used that to carry our bottles in.
We took the bottles to a grocery store
and were paid a penny for small beer bottles
and two cents for large ones. On almost
any day we could be seen pushing our baby
buggy along the highway looking
for beer bottles.
~Brautigan
WSClark said:
Eighty Freakin' Four Degrees tomorrow? I refuse to start the AC in April!!!!
Random thoughts for Saturday............
My granddaughter will be over this afternoon to spend the rest of the weekend with Gramps. Even have a busy schedule planned. We going to visit the park to play on the swings, maybe bake some brownies, tomorrow morning we'll get up and make breakfast for Uncle when he gets home from work.
Eighty dead or wounded in Iraq this morning - all I can do is shake my head. What a foreign policy disaster. What a mess. If this is not a civil war, what the Hell is it?
The NFL draft is on ESPN. JaMarcus Russell was just drafted #1. I wish I was his agent. Great kid that's going to make about $150 million over the next ten years. I could live on ten percent of that!
Cool, most of the folks at the Draft (including the first pick) are wearing VT pins - classy.
I have to grill tomorrow afternoon. Gotta!
Anyway, off to do some chores before my little angel shows up. Catch you all later!!!
Be good or don't get caught!!!
Random thoughts for Saturday............
My granddaughter will be over this afternoon to spend the rest of the weekend with Gramps. Even have a busy schedule planned. We going to visit the park to play on the swings, maybe bake some brownies, tomorrow morning we'll get up and make breakfast for Uncle when he gets home from work.
Eighty dead or wounded in Iraq this morning - all I can do is shake my head. What a foreign policy disaster. What a mess. If this is not a civil war, what the Hell is it?
The NFL draft is on ESPN. JaMarcus Russell was just drafted #1. I wish I was his agent. Great kid that's going to make about $150 million over the next ten years. I could live on ten percent of that!
Cool, most of the folks at the Draft (including the first pick) are wearing VT pins - classy.
I have to grill tomorrow afternoon. Gotta!
Anyway, off to do some chores before my little angel shows up. Catch you all later!!!
Be good or don't get caught!!!
Vaughn Tolle said:
Linda, glad you survived the ordeal.
WS, I just gotta grill tomorrow too, for my sanity; the forecast for wind tomorrow gives me little hope of being able to do so.
WS, I just gotta grill tomorrow too, for my sanity; the forecast for wind tomorrow gives me little hope of being able to do so.
lindainks55 said:
Retired General: Bush should sign Iraq bill
"President Bush should sign legislation starting the withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq on Oct. 1, retired Army Lt. Gen. William Odom said Saturday."
"The general accused Bush of squandering U.S. lives and helping Iran and al-Qaida when he invaded Iraq."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/politics/47...
I suppose this man who served honorably will be "swift boated." The truth becomes more and more clear to most everyone.
"President Bush should sign legislation starting the withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq on Oct. 1, retired Army Lt. Gen. William Odom said Saturday."
"The general accused Bush of squandering U.S. lives and helping Iran and al-Qaida when he invaded Iraq."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/politics/47...
I suppose this man who served honorably will be "swift boated." The truth becomes more and more clear to most everyone.
Predestined said:
Odom has been against the Iraq "war" for some time. He was one of the several generals who joined forces and started their own group against this mess.
lindainks55 said:
"The showdown over Iraq that's been brewing since the November elections will finally come to a head this week as Congress sends a war-spending bill to President Bush. Though the bill authorizes $100 billion for the war, Bush has rejected its October deadline for beginning the withdrawal of combat troops, with the goal of bringing combat troops home by April 2008, and has promised to use his veto—his second-ever use of this power—to kill it.
On Jan. 13, during his weekly radio address, Bush challenged those who disagreed with him to offer their own plan for Iraq. Led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., Rep. David Obey, D-Wis., and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., Congress met Bush's challenge to come up with an alternative policy.
But instead of seeking the dialogue he asked for in his own radio address, Bush and the Republicans went on the attack, calling the bill "defeatist" and "a cut and run" strategy. The truth is that the measure offers a change of course, not a 180-degree reversal. If Bush and Republicans can't agree to a plan as moderate as the one passed this week, then they really do want a war with no end.
The legislation sets a date to start rolling back Bush's escalation of 30,000 troops and calls for bringing home the rest of the combat troops. Instead of leaving the void that many of the war's bitter-enders predict, the bill would reposition roughly 20,000 to 60,000 troops for counterterrorism missions, protecting diplomats and training Iraqi troops. Finally, the measure sets benchmarks for the Iraqi government to meet in order to continue receiving U.S. financial assistance."
continue reading at:
http://www.fpif.org/fpifoped/4182
On Jan. 13, during his weekly radio address, Bush challenged those who disagreed with him to offer their own plan for Iraq. Led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., Rep. David Obey, D-Wis., and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., Congress met Bush's challenge to come up with an alternative policy.
But instead of seeking the dialogue he asked for in his own radio address, Bush and the Republicans went on the attack, calling the bill "defeatist" and "a cut and run" strategy. The truth is that the measure offers a change of course, not a 180-degree reversal. If Bush and Republicans can't agree to a plan as moderate as the one passed this week, then they really do want a war with no end.
The legislation sets a date to start rolling back Bush's escalation of 30,000 troops and calls for bringing home the rest of the combat troops. Instead of leaving the void that many of the war's bitter-enders predict, the bill would reposition roughly 20,000 to 60,000 troops for counterterrorism missions, protecting diplomats and training Iraqi troops. Finally, the measure sets benchmarks for the Iraqi government to meet in order to continue receiving U.S. financial assistance."
continue reading at:
http://www.fpif.org/fpifoped/4182
lindainks55 said:
I'm not sure I was the last hold out, but now I have gone back and read (even posted!) to WEBlog. sigh
lindainks55 said:
The meetings next Thursday and Friday should be very interesting. Iran has now announced they will be represented. Now this is making some progress -- or at least IF bushco (in this case Rice) know what the word diplomacy means.
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/04/29/news/iraq.p...
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/04/29/news/iraq.p...
WSClark said:
Ah, some of us still wander over to WE Blog for the S & G factor, but only a few actually post there. I posted there for a while, but I gave it up. Republican and GSher have pretty much taken over the blog, so it has little value to me.
I did read where Republican was accusing someone of being me, so I guess my presence is being felt, even when I am not there. Who knew?
The weather is great today. Got back from the park a while ago. My granddaughter and I played on the teeter-tauter and the swings. She's out of school tomorrow, so she's going to stay tonight with me too. Right now, she and I are making a "book" about bees. She has drawn a few and so have I. I draw like I sing - not for public consumption.
Go post about Bush and the war, Linda. This should be an interesting week for the country. I truly hope that the Democrats do not back down. Fund the war - with timelines. No more blank checks.
Well, now it is time to make a tent with the coffee table...............
Back at ya' later!
I did read where Republican was accusing someone of being me, so I guess my presence is being felt, even when I am not there. Who knew?
The weather is great today. Got back from the park a while ago. My granddaughter and I played on the teeter-tauter and the swings. She's out of school tomorrow, so she's going to stay tonight with me too. Right now, she and I are making a "book" about bees. She has drawn a few and so have I. I draw like I sing - not for public consumption.
Go post about Bush and the war, Linda. This should be an interesting week for the country. I truly hope that the Democrats do not back down. Fund the war - with timelines. No more blank checks.
Well, now it is time to make a tent with the coffee table...............
Back at ya' later!
Predestined said:
Will, you need a card table/folding table. Even grandpa can get under those. *grin*
Linda, the fuzzy you're talking about does NOT tickle. It hurts. Let GWB veto it. The Republicans keep asking for a "plan", but when they get one, they don't like it. Yet, other than staying the course and repeating the same insanity, they haven't come up with anything different. So who's the losers here?
I need to go check out the voting record for this to see who to vote for and who not to vote for. Then again, that might be easy to figure out.
Linda, the fuzzy you're talking about does NOT tickle. It hurts. Let GWB veto it. The Republicans keep asking for a "plan", but when they get one, they don't like it. Yet, other than staying the course and repeating the same insanity, they haven't come up with anything different. So who's the losers here?
I need to go check out the voting record for this to see who to vote for and who not to vote for. Then again, that might be easy to figure out.
lindainks55 said:
This is worth reading.
Tension rises in Washington over war-funding bill standoff. Congress is eyeing three strategies after an all-but-certain White House veto of the Iraq war bill.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0430/p01s01-uspo.htm...
Tension rises in Washington over war-funding bill standoff. Congress is eyeing three strategies after an all-but-certain White House veto of the Iraq war bill.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0430/p01s01-uspo.htm...
WSClark said:
I am in favor of option three - Congress should tell Bush to eat the dinner on his plate or go hungry. No more fooling around, no deadlines, no funding, end of war.
I would not be overly opposed if Bush came to Congress with his hat in his hand, to fund the war for three months at a time, with increasingly more severe benchmarks and timelines, but that would be as far as I would want them to go.
Contrary to Republican opinion (when there is a Republican president) only Congress can spend money. The bill to fund the war has to start in the House of Representatives - no exceptions.
If Bush wants dollar one for his War of Choice, he is going to have to accept some serious conditions.
Like an exit "stratergy."
I would not be overly opposed if Bush came to Congress with his hat in his hand, to fund the war for three months at a time, with increasingly more severe benchmarks and timelines, but that would be as far as I would want them to go.
Contrary to Republican opinion (when there is a Republican president) only Congress can spend money. The bill to fund the war has to start in the House of Representatives - no exceptions.
If Bush wants dollar one for his War of Choice, he is going to have to accept some serious conditions.
Like an exit "stratergy."
WSClark said:
Read this and then decide for yourself whether Bush is incompetent, stupid or a combination of the two. This is his administration and he has no one to blame but himself.
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1615848,00.html
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1615848,00.html
Nathan said:
A demand for withdrawl is not a plan. It is quiting.
When we ask for a plan or for a strategy it is fairly obvious that we were looking for the democrats plan for victory, not defeat.
It is sad that when asked for a plan the only one the democrats can offer is a "strategy" of defeat.
Actually, I don't think you can really call demands for withdrawl politically attached to a funding bill a strategy or plan at all.
But please, don't let me stop your little party of defeat with your grand strategy and plan for... defeat.
When we ask for a plan or for a strategy it is fairly obvious that we were looking for the democrats plan for victory, not defeat.
It is sad that when asked for a plan the only one the democrats can offer is a "strategy" of defeat.
Actually, I don't think you can really call demands for withdrawl politically attached to a funding bill a strategy or plan at all.
But please, don't let me stop your little party of defeat with your grand strategy and plan for... defeat.
WSClark said:
If I recall, the last time you were asked Nathan, you indicated that you thought it would take at least two more years of combat and five more years of occupation to control Iraq.
When did the American people, through our representatives, agree to an eleven year military involvement in Iraq? In 2003, we were told by then Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld that the military involvement would be no more than six months and the cost would be no more than $50 billion.
Four years and $677 billion later, we are no closer to the end than we were in March of 2003.
The American people, through our representatives in the House, have demanded an end to the war. Our money cannot be spent without our approval and we are denying that approval unless it is conditional. The president, regardless of his capacity as it relates to the military cannot spend our money unless we appropriate it. We, through our representative is Congress were not advised that the occupation of Iraq would be into it's fifth year by now. In fact, we were given no indication that there would be an occupation.
The war was to remove Saddam. He is gone. End the war.
When did the American people, through our representatives, agree to an eleven year military involvement in Iraq? In 2003, we were told by then Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld that the military involvement would be no more than six months and the cost would be no more than $50 billion.
Four years and $677 billion later, we are no closer to the end than we were in March of 2003.
The American people, through our representatives in the House, have demanded an end to the war. Our money cannot be spent without our approval and we are denying that approval unless it is conditional. The president, regardless of his capacity as it relates to the military cannot spend our money unless we appropriate it. We, through our representative is Congress were not advised that the occupation of Iraq would be into it's fifth year by now. In fact, we were given no indication that there would be an occupation.
The war was to remove Saddam. He is gone. End the war.
Nathan said:
WS Clark,
The American people also elected George Bush to be the President and Commander in Cheif.
If your representatives are truly representing the people in their actions, they would stop playing politics with the funding.
The American people also elected George Bush to be the President and Commander in Cheif.
If your representatives are truly representing the people in their actions, they would stop playing politics with the funding.
Hank Price said:
Not to mention, that saying the American people demanded their representatives to do this is a far stretch.
I could only imagine if people acted this way during WWII.
During WWII more Americans were killed during single battles than this entire war.
The invasion of Iraq alone was expected to cost us about 10,000 American lives.
Yet here we are having our Senate leader declaring our defeat?
It is a disgrace. How sad that you democrats sit here acting all high and mighty when your leader in the Senate is undermining our military effort.
You sit here playing politics with this war and then have the gaul to gloat about it.
The party of defeat.
I could only imagine if people acted this way during WWII.
During WWII more Americans were killed during single battles than this entire war.
The invasion of Iraq alone was expected to cost us about 10,000 American lives.
Yet here we are having our Senate leader declaring our defeat?
It is a disgrace. How sad that you democrats sit here acting all high and mighty when your leader in the Senate is undermining our military effort.
You sit here playing politics with this war and then have the gaul to gloat about it.
The party of defeat.
WSClark said:
There are three branches of the Federal government, as intended, there are checks and balances. Bush is the president, not the King. His status as CIC does not give him the right to override Congress when it comes to spending.
There are no politics being played with the appropriations bill that was passed by Congress. If Bush vetoes a legitimate spending bill, then that is playing politics.
He asked for funding and was given funding - with strings attached. It is his right to ask and it is Congress' right to insist on a deadline.
It's our money.
According to what we were told when the use of force was authorized, war would be the last resort. We were never told that Bush had planned an occupation. Go back and read the reports from 2002 and early 2003. There is not a single mention of a lengthy occupation.
There are no politics being played with the appropriations bill that was passed by Congress. If Bush vetoes a legitimate spending bill, then that is playing politics.
He asked for funding and was given funding - with strings attached. It is his right to ask and it is Congress' right to insist on a deadline.
It's our money.
According to what we were told when the use of force was authorized, war would be the last resort. We were never told that Bush had planned an occupation. Go back and read the reports from 2002 and early 2003. There is not a single mention of a lengthy occupation.
Nathan said:
WS Clark,
We were told this fight would be long and hard. We were told that we would stay until the job was finished.
Simply because things did not go perfectly according to plan is not cause for the democrats to rally around defeat.
The democrats are most definately playing politics with the funding and by doing so are underming the current strategy in Iraq.
They are not even willing to give success a chance.
The only thing your party offers is defeat and you sit here gloating about it. How sad is that?
We were told this fight would be long and hard. We were told that we would stay until the job was finished.
Simply because things did not go perfectly according to plan is not cause for the democrats to rally around defeat.
The democrats are most definately playing politics with the funding and by doing so are underming the current strategy in Iraq.
They are not even willing to give success a chance.
The only thing your party offers is defeat and you sit here gloating about it. How sad is that?
WSClark said:
to even attempt to compare the War on Iraq to the Second World War is ludicrous and does a great disservice to men like my father and uncles that served at that time.
We were attacked by Japan and the following day Germany declared war on the US.
Iraq never attacked the United States.
If Bush and the Republicans want to treat the War on Iraq in the same manner as WW II, let Bush approach Congress with a request for a formal Declaration of War.
We were attacked by Japan and the following day Germany declared war on the US.
Iraq never attacked the United States.
If Bush and the Republicans want to treat the War on Iraq in the same manner as WW II, let Bush approach Congress with a request for a formal Declaration of War.
WSClark said:
"I support the withdrawal of United States Armed Forces as soon as possible. That does not mean
as soon as order is restored. It does not mean as soon as democracy is flourishing. It does not mean
as soon as we have established a viable nation. As soon as possible means as soon we can get out
without losing any more American lives.”
Who said this about American military involvement?
as soon as order is restored. It does not mean as soon as democracy is flourishing. It does not mean
as soon as we have established a viable nation. As soon as possible means as soon we can get out
without losing any more American lives.”
Who said this about American military involvement?
WSClark52 said:
Answer? John McCain (R-Republican) screaming at Clinton about Haiti, Oct 6, 1994.
By the way, Clinton lost zero military personnel in Hati.
By the way, Clinton lost zero military personnel in Hati.
Predestined said:
It's only a defeat if that's the way you see it.
If the job of going into Iraq had been done with a plan in mind, we wouldn't still be there. It was a hodge podge job, apparently orchestrated by people who didn't do their homework and research or didn't listen to advisors. If this is a defeat, it's the Bush Administration's defeat and only the defeat of the American people because we and our representatives allowed it.
We've been riding a stationary bike for almost 4 years. We've gained nothing. Bush had few benchmarks in place. When asked when this would be over, he would say...
1. When Saddam is captured.
DONE
2. When the Iraqi's have their new constitution in place.
DONE
3. When the Iraqi people are able to have a free and democratic election.
DONE
4. When we bring freedom to the Iraqis.
Freedom from what? From Saddam's rule? Done. From terrorism? We're growing it there. From what? U.S. occupation? Because that's the way the Iraqi people see it.
Does this mean we will never be done?
Powell pointed out the pottery barn rule: We break it, we own it. We now own a country in political and religious turmoil. A country that's infrastructure WE destroyed, where the homes are in ruins, water is scarce, electricity is almost non-existent, and medical help is vanishing. Tell me, please, is this freedom?
If the job of going into Iraq had been done with a plan in mind, we wouldn't still be there. It was a hodge podge job, apparently orchestrated by people who didn't do their homework and research or didn't listen to advisors. If this is a defeat, it's the Bush Administration's defeat and only the defeat of the American people because we and our representatives allowed it.
We've been riding a stationary bike for almost 4 years. We've gained nothing. Bush had few benchmarks in place. When asked when this would be over, he would say...
1. When Saddam is captured.
DONE
2. When the Iraqi's have their new constitution in place.
DONE
3. When the Iraqi people are able to have a free and democratic election.
DONE
4. When we bring freedom to the Iraqis.
Freedom from what? From Saddam's rule? Done. From terrorism? We're growing it there. From what? U.S. occupation? Because that's the way the Iraqi people see it.
Does this mean we will never be done?
Powell pointed out the pottery barn rule: We break it, we own it. We now own a country in political and religious turmoil. A country that's infrastructure WE destroyed, where the homes are in ruins, water is scarce, electricity is almost non-existent, and medical help is vanishing. Tell me, please, is this freedom?
WSClark said:
The only way to "disown" Iraq is to pull out and let them decide for themselves how the country will be run. It is rather arrogant of us to presume to decide for them that they aren't doing it right. They elected Maliki as PM - let them deal with it.
Julie said:
Nathan,
I hate to nitpick but I gotta call you out on this post addressed to Clark:
"The American people also elected George Bush to be the President and Commander in Cheif.
If your representatives are truly representing the people in their actions, they would stop playing politics with the funding.
Posted By Nathan | 4/29/07 11:48 PM "
Technically the American people elected Al Gore in 2000 (IIRC), Gore won the 'popular' vote. However, the popular vote doesn't amount to anything. The Electoral College is the entity that really votes in a President. While in theory the EC should follow the votes of their respective states in actuality it really doesn't matter - they can vote however they want. All the Florida mess - didn't matter (from an EC point of view, but don't get me wrong - it definitely showed serious problems in the system)
I hate to nitpick but I gotta call you out on this post addressed to Clark:
"The American people also elected George Bush to be the President and Commander in Cheif.
If your representatives are truly representing the people in their actions, they would stop playing politics with the funding.
Posted By Nathan | 4/29/07 11:48 PM "
Technically the American people elected Al Gore in 2000 (IIRC), Gore won the 'popular' vote. However, the popular vote doesn't amount to anything. The Electoral College is the entity that really votes in a President. While in theory the EC should follow the votes of their respective states in actuality it really doesn't matter - they can vote however they want. All the Florida mess - didn't matter (from an EC point of view, but don't get me wrong - it definitely showed serious problems in the system)
Julie said:
MEET UP
Saturday May 12
11:30am - 3:30pm
(time had to be bumped up because they've got another party coming in right after)
Watson Park
Shelter #1
BE THERE OR BE SQUARE
Saturday May 12
11:30am - 3:30pm
(time had to be bumped up because they've got another party coming in right after)
Watson Park
Shelter #1
BE THERE OR BE SQUARE
Julie said:
I think there may be a 12 step program to help you.
Realizing that there is a problem is always the first step.
Realizing that there is a problem is always the first step.
Gster said:
12 is an awfully big number- do you have anything in the 3 to 4 step range? I have a short attention span these days.
Hank Price said:
Julie,
Technically, you are wrong.
There is nothing technical about the 2000 election. According to election law and the way presidents are elected Bush won and Gore lost.
There is nothing technical about it.
There is no "serious" problem with the system. The system worked just fine as it was intended to do.
Technically, you are wrong.
There is nothing technical about the 2000 election. According to election law and the way presidents are elected Bush won and Gore lost.
There is nothing technical about it.
There is no "serious" problem with the system. The system worked just fine as it was intended to do.
Nathan said:
Fact Sheet: Update on the New Iraq Strategy
Helping Iraq's Leaders Secure Their Population
On April 20, 2007, President Bush Updated The American People On His New Iraq Strategy. In January, President Bush and his Administration concluded an extensive review of the situation in Iraq and made major changes to our strategy in Iraq. The President described how this new campaign is unfolding in Baghdad, Anbar Province, and the outskirts of Baghdad where terrorists and extremists are making a stand.
* The New Strategy Recognizes That Our Top Priority Must Be To Help Iraq’s Leaders Secure Their Population, Especially In Baghdad. Until the Iraqi people have a basic measure of security, they will not be able to make political and economic progress.
* We Are Seeing Positive Indicators Under The New Strategy That We Hope Will Translate Into Positive Trends. General Petraeus has been carrying out this new strategy for just over two months. He reports that it will be later this year before we can judge its potential for success. Yet the first indicators show that the operation is meeting our expectations. While there are still horrific attacks in Iraq, the direction of the fight is beginning to shift.
* Iraqi And American Forces Are Making Incremental Gains In The Iraqi Capital.
o American and Iraqi forces tracked down and captured the leaders of a major car bomb ring.
o We found and cleared a warehouse where terrorists were storing chemicals to make weapons.
o We captured members of a death squad that had paralyzed hundreds of residents in a Baghdad neighborhood.
o Displaced families are beginning to return home.
o The number of sectarian murders in Baghdad has dropped by half since the operation began.
* Democrats In Congress Are Pushing Legislation That Would Undercut The Strategy General Petraeus Has Just Started To Pursue. Democratic leaders need to put politics aside and send the President a bill that funds our troops without artificial deadlines or wasteful spending and without handcuffing our commanders.
o It has now been 74 days since the President requested emergency funding. Our men and women in uniform should never be caught in the middle of a debate in Washington.
o To cover ongoing Army operations, the Pentagon is being forced to transfer money from military personnel accounts.
The Most Significant Element Of Our New Strategy Is Being Carried Out In Baghdad
Baghdad Was The Site Of Most Of The Sectarian Violence In Iraq And Is The Destination For Most Of Our Reinforcements. Three additional American brigades have reached the Iraqi capital, while another is in Kuwait preparing to deploy to Iraq and one more will arrive next month.
* The Iraqi Government Is Meeting Its Pledge To Boost Force Levels In Baghdad. For every American combat soldier deployed to Baghdad, there are now about three members of the Iraqi Security Force.
* American Troops Are Now Living And Working Side-By-Side With Iraqi Forces At Small Neighborhood Posts Called Joint Security Stations, And Cooperation And Tips Have Increased. Late last year, most American troops were at bases on the outskirts of the city. They would move into Baghdad to help Iraqi forces clear neighborhoods during the day and then return to their bases at night, allowing the insurgents and death squads to move back to the neighborhoods. Troops in Baghdad are changing their positions in the city, and today:
o There are more than two dozen Joint Security Stations located throughout Baghdad, and more are planned.
o Iraqi and American forces are working together to clear out and secure neighborhoods.
o If a heavy fight breaks out, American forces step in and Iraqi forces learn valuable skills fighting shoulder-to-shoulder with our troops.
* Iraqi And American Forces Have Received More Tips In The Past Three Months Than During Any Three-Month Period On Record. By living in Baghdad neighborhoods, American forces get to know the culture and concerns of local residents, and local residents get to know them and gain confidence and trust. Many of the tips received in the past three months have led to successful operations against terrorists and insurgents.
U.S. And Iraqi Security Forces Are Carrying Out The New Strategy In Anbar Province
While Anbar Province Is Still Not Safe, Significant Progress Is Occurring. For much of the past four years, insurgents and al Qaeda members terrorized the local population through a ruthless campaign of violence. Now the situation has begun to change:
* Tribal sheiks have begun cooperating with American and Iraqi forces to fight al Qaeda by providing highly specific intelligence.
* We have sent more troops to Anbar Province.
* Significant changes are taking place in Ramadi, where the presence of al Qaeda terrorists in the city has declined substantially in the past six months.
As Al Qaeda Responds To These Changes With Sickening Brutality, Local Sunnis Are Refusing To Be Intimidated And Are Stepping Forward To Drive Out The Terrorists.
We Are Adjusting To Conditions In Other Areas Of Iraq.
We Are Cracking Down On Extremists Gathering In Other Parts Of Iraq.
* We are increasing our force levels and carrying out aggressive operations in the “Baghdad belts” – the areas on the outskirts of the capital that have been staging grounds for deadly attacks.
* We have moved an additional Stryker battalion to Diyala Province.
* We have sent reinforcements to Diwaniyah, where we are working with Iraqi forces to root out militia fighters and other Shia extremists.
Our Enemies Are Fighting Back As American And Iraqi Forces Fight To Clear And Hold Territory The Enemy Considers Its Own, But Our Operations Are Having An Important Impact. As violence increases in these areas, American and Iraqi operations are:
* Keeping the pressure on terrorists and insurgents who flee Baghdad and Anbar Province
* Helping cut off the supply of weapons and fighters to violent groups inside the Iraqi capital
* Showing Iraqi citizens across the country that there will be no sanctuary for killers anywhere in a free Iraq
We Are Working With Iraqis To Make Political And Economic Progress
As We Increase Our Troop Levels, We Are Also Increasing Our Civilian Presence. We are doubling the number of Provincial Reconstruction Teams that help restore basic services, stimulate job creation, and promote reconciliation.
Military Operations Are Beginning To Open Up Breathing Space For Political Progress. Iraq's leaders must take advantage of this space to make further political progress. America’s patience is not unlimited, but we understand that the Iraqi government is working hard in an extremely difficult environment.
Iraq’s Government Is Beginning To Follow Through On Securing The Free And Democratic Future That Nearly Twelve Million Iraqis Voted For.
* The Iraqi legislature met a key benchmark by passing a budget that commits 10 billion dollars for reconstruction project
* The Council of Ministers recently approved legislation that would provide a framework for an equitable sharing of oil resources – and now that legislation is going before the Iraqi parliament for its approval
* The government has formed a committee to organize provincial elections
* The Iraqi cabinet is taking steps to finalize toward agreement on a de-Baathification law.
* At a conference in Egypt next month, Prime Minister Maliki will seek increased diplomatic and financial commitments for Iraq’s democracy.
Giving Up In Iraq Would Have Consequences Far Beyond Iraq’s Borders. It is natural to wish there was an easy way out, yet in Iraq the easy road would be disastrous since Iraq is a battlefront in a much broader struggle. We cannot allow terrorists to gain a safe haven overseas like they had in Afghanistan during the 1990s, especially in a land with vast oil resources that terrorists could use to fund their ambitions.
Withdrawal Is Not A Strategy. Withdrawal would do nothing to prevent violence from spilling out across the country and plunging Iraq into chaos and anarchy. If anything, it would make that more likely.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/iraq/
Helping Iraq's Leaders Secure Their Population
On April 20, 2007, President Bush Updated The American People On His New Iraq Strategy. In January, President Bush and his Administration concluded an extensive review of the situation in Iraq and made major changes to our strategy in Iraq. The President described how this new campaign is unfolding in Baghdad, Anbar Province, and the outskirts of Baghdad where terrorists and extremists are making a stand.
* The New Strategy Recognizes That Our Top Priority Must Be To Help Iraq’s Leaders Secure Their Population, Especially In Baghdad. Until the Iraqi people have a basic measure of security, they will not be able to make political and economic progress.
* We Are Seeing Positive Indicators Under The New Strategy That We Hope Will Translate Into Positive Trends. General Petraeus has been carrying out this new strategy for just over two months. He reports that it will be later this year before we can judge its potential for success. Yet the first indicators show that the operation is meeting our expectations. While there are still horrific attacks in Iraq, the direction of the fight is beginning to shift.
* Iraqi And American Forces Are Making Incremental Gains In The Iraqi Capital.
o American and Iraqi forces tracked down and captured the leaders of a major car bomb ring.
o We found and cleared a warehouse where terrorists were storing chemicals to make weapons.
o We captured members of a death squad that had paralyzed hundreds of residents in a Baghdad neighborhood.
o Displaced families are beginning to return home.
o The number of sectarian murders in Baghdad has dropped by half since the operation began.
* Democrats In Congress Are Pushing Legislation That Would Undercut The Strategy General Petraeus Has Just Started To Pursue. Democratic leaders need to put politics aside and send the President a bill that funds our troops without artificial deadlines or wasteful spending and without handcuffing our commanders.
o It has now been 74 days since the President requested emergency funding. Our men and women in uniform should never be caught in the middle of a debate in Washington.
o To cover ongoing Army operations, the Pentagon is being forced to transfer money from military personnel accounts.
The Most Significant Element Of Our New Strategy Is Being Carried Out In Baghdad
Baghdad Was The Site Of Most Of The Sectarian Violence In Iraq And Is The Destination For Most Of Our Reinforcements. Three additional American brigades have reached the Iraqi capital, while another is in Kuwait preparing to deploy to Iraq and one more will arrive next month.
* The Iraqi Government Is Meeting Its Pledge To Boost Force Levels In Baghdad. For every American combat soldier deployed to Baghdad, there are now about three members of the Iraqi Security Force.
* American Troops Are Now Living And Working Side-By-Side With Iraqi Forces At Small Neighborhood Posts Called Joint Security Stations, And Cooperation And Tips Have Increased. Late last year, most American troops were at bases on the outskirts of the city. They would move into Baghdad to help Iraqi forces clear neighborhoods during the day and then return to their bases at night, allowing the insurgents and death squads to move back to the neighborhoods. Troops in Baghdad are changing their positions in the city, and today:
o There are more than two dozen Joint Security Stations located throughout Baghdad, and more are planned.
o Iraqi and American forces are working together to clear out and secure neighborhoods.
o If a heavy fight breaks out, American forces step in and Iraqi forces learn valuable skills fighting shoulder-to-shoulder with our troops.
* Iraqi And American Forces Have Received More Tips In The Past Three Months Than During Any Three-Month Period On Record. By living in Baghdad neighborhoods, American forces get to know the culture and concerns of local residents, and local residents get to know them and gain confidence and trust. Many of the tips received in the past three months have led to successful operations against terrorists and insurgents.
U.S. And Iraqi Security Forces Are Carrying Out The New Strategy In Anbar Province
While Anbar Province Is Still Not Safe, Significant Progress Is Occurring. For much of the past four years, insurgents and al Qaeda members terrorized the local population through a ruthless campaign of violence. Now the situation has begun to change:
* Tribal sheiks have begun cooperating with American and Iraqi forces to fight al Qaeda by providing highly specific intelligence.
* We have sent more troops to Anbar Province.
* Significant changes are taking place in Ramadi, where the presence of al Qaeda terrorists in the city has declined substantially in the past six months.
As Al Qaeda Responds To These Changes With Sickening Brutality, Local Sunnis Are Refusing To Be Intimidated And Are Stepping Forward To Drive Out The Terrorists.
We Are Adjusting To Conditions In Other Areas Of Iraq.
We Are Cracking Down On Extremists Gathering In Other Parts Of Iraq.
* We are increasing our force levels and carrying out aggressive operations in the “Baghdad belts” – the areas on the outskirts of the capital that have been staging grounds for deadly attacks.
* We have moved an additional Stryker battalion to Diyala Province.
* We have sent reinforcements to Diwaniyah, where we are working with Iraqi forces to root out militia fighters and other Shia extremists.
Our Enemies Are Fighting Back As American And Iraqi Forces Fight To Clear And Hold Territory The Enemy Considers Its Own, But Our Operations Are Having An Important Impact. As violence increases in these areas, American and Iraqi operations are:
* Keeping the pressure on terrorists and insurgents who flee Baghdad and Anbar Province
* Helping cut off the supply of weapons and fighters to violent groups inside the Iraqi capital
* Showing Iraqi citizens across the country that there will be no sanctuary for killers anywhere in a free Iraq
We Are Working With Iraqis To Make Political And Economic Progress
As We Increase Our Troop Levels, We Are Also Increasing Our Civilian Presence. We are doubling the number of Provincial Reconstruction Teams that help restore basic services, stimulate job creation, and promote reconciliation.
Military Operations Are Beginning To Open Up Breathing Space For Political Progress. Iraq's leaders must take advantage of this space to make further political progress. America’s patience is not unlimited, but we understand that the Iraqi government is working hard in an extremely difficult environment.
Iraq’s Government Is Beginning To Follow Through On Securing The Free And Democratic Future That Nearly Twelve Million Iraqis Voted For.
* The Iraqi legislature met a key benchmark by passing a budget that commits 10 billion dollars for reconstruction project
* The Council of Ministers recently approved legislation that would provide a framework for an equitable sharing of oil resources – and now that legislation is going before the Iraqi parliament for its approval
* The government has formed a committee to organize provincial elections
* The Iraqi cabinet is taking steps to finalize toward agreement on a de-Baathification law.
* At a conference in Egypt next month, Prime Minister Maliki will seek increased diplomatic and financial commitments for Iraq’s democracy.
Giving Up In Iraq Would Have Consequences Far Beyond Iraq’s Borders. It is natural to wish there was an easy way out, yet in Iraq the easy road would be disastrous since Iraq is a battlefront in a much broader struggle. We cannot allow terrorists to gain a safe haven overseas like they had in Afghanistan during the 1990s, especially in a land with vast oil resources that terrorists could use to fund their ambitions.
Withdrawal Is Not A Strategy. Withdrawal would do nothing to prevent violence from spilling out across the country and plunging Iraq into chaos and anarchy. If anything, it would make that more likely.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/iraq/
Hank Price said:
As we said at our March 16 meeting in the Azores, we will uphold our responsibility to help the people of Iraq build a nation that is whole, free and at peace with itself and its neighbors.
George Bush April 8th 2003
Coalition forces will remain in Iraq as long as necessary to help the Iraqi people to build their own political institutions and reconstruct their country, but no longer.
George Bush April 8th 2003
George Bush April 8th 2003
Coalition forces will remain in Iraq as long as necessary to help the Iraqi people to build their own political institutions and reconstruct their country, but no longer.
George Bush April 8th 2003
Nathan said:
There was never any statement that we would simply leave once Iraq was a "democracy."
Bush has said since the beginning that a free and stable Iraq was the goal.
Only a bunch of democrats would be sitting here talking about how we are finished and can leave when the country is still not stable and needs our help.
Of course you don't care about any of the lives in Iraq. You only care about how you can use those deaths to keep saying how things are bad and we need to leave. (At least WS Clark admitted to not caring about the Iraqi's whose lives are lost)
How about the rest of you? Do you care at all about Iraqi's who would loose their lives if we simply pull out? Are they just political talking points to use against the war for you too?
Bush has said since the beginning that a free and stable Iraq was the goal.
Only a bunch of democrats would be sitting here talking about how we are finished and can leave when the country is still not stable and needs our help.
Of course you don't care about any of the lives in Iraq. You only care about how you can use those deaths to keep saying how things are bad and we need to leave. (At least WS Clark admitted to not caring about the Iraqi's whose lives are lost)
How about the rest of you? Do you care at all about Iraqi's who would loose their lives if we simply pull out? Are they just political talking points to use against the war for you too?
Danny said:
May 12th for the meetup, now see I'll be running in the river run(2 mile, as I'm not quite to 10k shape yet). So, the 12th wouldn't necessarily be bad.
In regards to Iraq,
See, I can admit I'm not military leader. Now given that, I think deadlines are specific parts of the mission are still a good thing. As it could paint a larger picture about when we ultimately do leave Iraq. I think that the majority of American's want that. Maybe a hard and fast deadline, this is when troops will begin coming home isn't what we are after, but at least an indication about well.. assuming deadlines are met on goals X, Y, and Z, then troop withdrawl could begin as early as.... fill in the date.
In regards to Iraq,
See, I can admit I'm not military leader. Now given that, I think deadlines are specific parts of the mission are still a good thing. As it could paint a larger picture about when we ultimately do leave Iraq. I think that the majority of American's want that. Maybe a hard and fast deadline, this is when troops will begin coming home isn't what we are after, but at least an indication about well.. assuming deadlines are met on goals X, Y, and Z, then troop withdrawl could begin as early as.... fill in the date.
Julie said:
Nathan,
I should not have included the word "technically". I apologize.
The problems that arose that I alluded to were the allegations of ballot miscounts, ballot fixing, throwing out uncounted votes and the infamous hanging chad.
You said that the American people voted gwb in. No, the Electoral College voted gwb in. The American People voted Al Gore in. That is what my original post was supposed to be about.
I should not have included the word "technically". I apologize.
The problems that arose that I alluded to were the allegations of ballot miscounts, ballot fixing, throwing out uncounted votes and the infamous hanging chad.
You said that the American people voted gwb in. No, the Electoral College voted gwb in. The American People voted Al Gore in. That is what my original post was supposed to be about.
WSClark said:
So, according to Bush and Nathan, the American people are to mortgage their future and sacrifice our servicemen and women while the Iraqis figure out what they want to do with their country - a country that we invaded needlessly?
If things have progressed in Iraq over the last four years, why does the Iraqi parliament have to office behind the walls of the Green Zone? Wouldn't the government of a free Iraq meet in public in audience of their people?
Tomorrow will be the fourth anniversary of the Mission Accomplished speech. When is this going to end?
If things have progressed in Iraq over the last four years, why does the Iraqi parliament have to office behind the walls of the Green Zone? Wouldn't the government of a free Iraq meet in public in audience of their people?
Tomorrow will be the fourth anniversary of the Mission Accomplished speech. When is this going to end?
Wendy said:
Clark,
it isn't going to end until Bush is out of office and someone else has to come in and clean up the mess. He has already admitted as much. Let's just hope that by then our International image isn't COMPLETELY screwed (although that is probably wishful thinking)
it isn't going to end until Bush is out of office and someone else has to come in and clean up the mess. He has already admitted as much. Let's just hope that by then our International image isn't COMPLETELY screwed (although that is probably wishful thinking)
Julie said:
It will end on the 6th.
(6th of what I'm still not clear on)
(Since gster is snark challenged today, I shall do my best to snark for him because what else are blogfriends good for?)
Nathan said:
Julie,
You are a smart person. Why are you still hung up on the 200 election?
Even after several of the Nations top papers went to Florida and examined the ballots they found that Bush won.
You are still sitting here talking about the ballots?
The people went to the polls and they elected Bush the way that the law prescribes. The Electoratal College represented the will of the people from their prescribed states.
Bush was elected by the will of the people as prescribed by the law.
The Presidential Election is not a popular vote.
You are a smart person. Why are you still hung up on the 200 election?
Even after several of the Nations top papers went to Florida and examined the ballots they found that Bush won.
You are still sitting here talking about the ballots?
The people went to the polls and they elected Bush the way that the law prescribes. The Electoratal College represented the will of the people from their prescribed states.
Bush was elected by the will of the people as prescribed by the law.
The Presidential Election is not a popular vote.
Nathan said:
Wendy,
Clean up the mess? So far the only thing the Democrats have offered is for us to quit.
Right now we are still there trying to clean up the mess.
So I don't understand what mess will be cleaned up by a different President when the only thing the Democrats have offered so far is to leave the mess and give up.
Clean up the mess? So far the only thing the Democrats have offered is for us to quit.
Right now we are still there trying to clean up the mess.
So I don't understand what mess will be cleaned up by a different President when the only thing the Democrats have offered so far is to leave the mess and give up.
Wendy said:
Nathan,
I am not saying that the Democrats have any plan. If you read my post instead of just looking for a fight everytime you got on here you would see that. Even your post above implies that Iraq is a mess. A quagmire if you will, that Bush isn't willing to even ATTEMPT to try to fix. He is just going to leave things the way they are and let someone else deal with it. He has already said so.
I am not saying that the Democrats have any plan. If you read my post instead of just looking for a fight everytime you got on here you would see that. Even your post above implies that Iraq is a mess. A quagmire if you will, that Bush isn't willing to even ATTEMPT to try to fix. He is just going to leave things the way they are and let someone else deal with it. He has already said so.
Hank Price said:
Wendy,
I have never said Iraq is not a "mess." I do not agree with calling it a quagmire though.
If Bush is not trying to fix it (according to you) then what do you call what we are doing right now, every single day there?
I would like to see the quote from Bush saying what you are attributing to him. I think you might be completely mischaracterizing what he has said.
You said something I disagree with. I commented on that. No fight here.
I have never said Iraq is not a "mess." I do not agree with calling it a quagmire though.
If Bush is not trying to fix it (according to you) then what do you call what we are doing right now, every single day there?
I would like to see the quote from Bush saying what you are attributing to him. I think you might be completely mischaracterizing what he has said.
You said something I disagree with. I commented on that. No fight here.
Vaughn Tolle said:
A blunt assessment on Iraq from Sen. Hagel upon his return from a fifth visit.
Note the items that the Iraqi parliament aren't acting on; note his response to the "leaving will create chaos" argument (paraphrasing, what do you think is going on there now?). Interesting read.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2007/04/...
Note the items that the Iraqi parliament aren't acting on; note his response to the "leaving will create chaos" argument (paraphrasing, what do you think is going on there now?). Interesting read.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2007/04/...
Vaughn Tolle said:
Also note that Sen. Hagel does not advocate quick, total pullout from the country; he appears to advocate getting U.S. troops out of Baghdad, with some troop level reduction.
Vaughn Tolle said:
(Compliments to CF2K for the link.)
If training the Iraqis to "take over" is no longer a priority, then other than trying to impose a "pax Americana" on Iraq, just WTF are we still doing there? The goals set out by the White House posted above by Nathan seem to be bogged down in the Iraqi government, as set forth by Sen. Hagel; if training is no longer a priority, this belies the "when they stand up, we'll stand down" meme; if the al-Maliki government grows weaker daily, as alleged by Sen. Hagel, then why isn't the "coalition" seeking elections for a replacement? Could it really be true that this situation has reached the point that military force cannot resolve it, at least the level of military force the U.S. and others are able/willing to bring?
http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/1710470...
As I have posted many times in more than one place, I was against the Iraq
If training the Iraqis to "take over" is no longer a priority, then other than trying to impose a "pax Americana" on Iraq, just WTF are we still doing there? The goals set out by the White House posted above by Nathan seem to be bogged down in the Iraqi government, as set forth by Sen. Hagel; if training is no longer a priority, this belies the "when they stand up, we'll stand down" meme; if the al-Maliki government grows weaker daily, as alleged by Sen. Hagel, then why isn't the "coalition" seeking elections for a replacement? Could it really be true that this situation has reached the point that military force cannot resolve it, at least the level of military force the U.S. and others are able/willing to bring?
http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/1710470...
As I have posted many times in more than one place, I was against the Iraq
Julie said:
Nathan,
I'm not hung up on the 2000 election. There were some issues that were brought to light at that time which need to be dealt with IMHO (throwing out uncounted ballots...).
I admit I'm nitpicking semantics here. You were the one that said the American people voted bush in. The MAJORITY of American people voted Gore in. The Electoral College voted bush. The EC is very different than the popular vote. It doesn't necessarily matter what the majority of a state votes, their electors can vote whatever they want.
Why do we even bother voting if our vote doesn't count when it really matters (the leader of our nation)?
As for the papers, I hardly think that they are an unbiased entity. Nice try.
Enough of this subject. I'm done.
I'm not hung up on the 2000 election. There were some issues that were brought to light at that time which need to be dealt with IMHO (throwing out uncounted ballots...).
I admit I'm nitpicking semantics here. You were the one that said the American people voted bush in. The MAJORITY of American people voted Gore in. The Electoral College voted bush. The EC is very different than the popular vote. It doesn't necessarily matter what the majority of a state votes, their electors can vote whatever they want.
Why do we even bother voting if our vote doesn't count when it really matters (the leader of our nation)?
As for the papers, I hardly think that they are an unbiased entity. Nice try.
Enough of this subject. I'm done.
Vaughn Tolle said:
(continuing on) invasion ab initio; the folks with much experience with that part of the world were warning, in 2002, that things weren't going to go as predicted. The failure of the inspectors to find the WMDs so widely reported caused me to wonder why the President didn't order the intelligence folks to bring fresh information to the table back in 2003.
Now, it appears that the military, as presently constituted, cannot resolve the situation. I, for one, wish that the recommendations contained in the ISG report be implemented; I really don't care by whom, or who gets the glory.
Now, it appears that the military, as presently constituted, cannot resolve the situation. I, for one, wish that the recommendations contained in the ISG report be implemented; I really don't care by whom, or who gets the glory.
Vaughn Tolle said:
Just read some criticisms of Mr. Tenent on cnn.com by former CIA personnel. The interesting thing to me was not that they were disputing his premise of no debate, inadequate intelligence, but rather his staying on to assist in the promotion of the invasion.
Wendy said:
Nathan:
Main Entry: quag·mire
Pronunciation: 'kwag-"mI(-&)r, 'kwäg-
Function: noun
1 : soft miry land that shakes or yields under the foot
2 : a difficult, precarious, or entrapping position : PREDICAMENT
From Merriam-Webster dictionary.
What is Iraq if it is not definition #2? It is a quagmire. I stand by my statement.
And for your reading pleasure:
"We’re not leaving so long as I’m the president. That would be a huge mistake." George Bush 8/21/06 in a televised statement.
By the way, I also found this, which I though rather ironic - it's a direct quote froma speech Bush gave at Ft. Bragg on 6/28/05 -
"Some Americans ask me, if completing the mission is so important, why don't you send more troops? If our commanders on the ground say we need more troops, I will send them. But our commanders tell me they have the number of troops they need to do their job. Sending more Americans would undermine our strategy of encouraging Iraqis to take the lead in this fight. And sending more Americans would suggest that we intend to stay forever, when we are, in fact, working for the day when Iraq can defend itself and we can leave. As we determine the right force level, our troops can know that I will continue to be guided by the advice that matters: the sober judgment of our military leaders. "
Main Entry: quag·mire
Pronunciation: 'kwag-"mI(-&)r, 'kwäg-
Function: noun
1 : soft miry land that shakes or yields under the foot
2 : a difficult, precarious, or entrapping position : PREDICAMENT
From Merriam-Webster dictionary.
What is Iraq if it is not definition #2? It is a quagmire. I stand by my statement.
And for your reading pleasure:
"We’re not leaving so long as I’m the president. That would be a huge mistake." George Bush 8/21/06 in a televised statement.
By the way, I also found this, which I though rather ironic - it's a direct quote froma speech Bush gave at Ft. Bragg on 6/28/05 -
"Some Americans ask me, if completing the mission is so important, why don't you send more troops? If our commanders on the ground say we need more troops, I will send them. But our commanders tell me they have the number of troops they need to do their job. Sending more Americans would undermine our strategy of encouraging Iraqis to take the lead in this fight. And sending more Americans would suggest that we intend to stay forever, when we are, in fact, working for the day when Iraq can defend itself and we can leave. As we determine the right force level, our troops can know that I will continue to be guided by the advice that matters: the sober judgment of our military leaders. "
WSClark said:
I had an Uncle that died due to disabilities that he suffered as a result of being wounded during WW II. I have other uncles and an adopted father that fought during the War. I am sick of hearing comparisons between Hitler and Axis powers and Saddam Hussein.
Hitler had a huge war machine that nearly conquered all of Europe. The Japanese nearly conquered all of Asia. Hitler made the Napoleonic mistake of invading the Soviet Union. Had he pursued a land invasion of England, he may well have been able to control all of Europe.
Saddam Hussein could not even control all of his own country.
The right may find it easier to support their debate points in they give up making ridiculous comparisons of Hitler and the Axis Powers and Saddam Hussein.
They are just making themselves look foolish.
Hitler had a huge war machine that nearly conquered all of Europe. The Japanese nearly conquered all of Asia. Hitler made the Napoleonic mistake of invading the Soviet Union. Had he pursued a land invasion of England, he may well have been able to control all of Europe.
Saddam Hussein could not even control all of his own country.
The right may find it easier to support their debate points in they give up making ridiculous comparisons of Hitler and the Axis Powers and Saddam Hussein.
They are just making themselves look foolish.
Nathan said:
WS Clark,
My comparisons with BATTLES of WWII and the current war is not any more ridiculous than those made comparing this war to Vietnam.
It is a simple comparison.
The way that many of those on the left, liberals, and Democrats respond to every single set back or loss of life in Iraq would be treated with absolute disdain if they responded that way during the many losses of life and setbacks we faced during not only WWII but many other wars in our history.
This is the first time the Congress has used funding to try to sabotage a war currently in progress.
You and I may disagree on this war, but we are fighting it right now. We have men and women risking their lives right now.
And the Demcorats are sitting in Congress playing politics with their funding.
How can you sit here and with a straight face say the democrats are doing anything less than playing the worst kind of politics with the funding of the troops when they are tacking on demands for withdrawl, funding for thier pet interests, and things like the minimum wage increase?
It is the worst kind of politics and even the Democratic Senate leader is undermining our troops by declaring defeat while we are still fighting the war.
Your party is acting in disgrace no matter what your opinion on this war might be.
My comparisons with BATTLES of WWII and the current war is not any more ridiculous than those made comparing this war to Vietnam.
It is a simple comparison.
The way that many of those on the left, liberals, and Democrats respond to every single set back or loss of life in Iraq would be treated with absolute disdain if they responded that way during the many losses of life and setbacks we faced during not only WWII but many other wars in our history.
This is the first time the Congress has used funding to try to sabotage a war currently in progress.
You and I may disagree on this war, but we are fighting it right now. We have men and women risking their lives right now.
And the Demcorats are sitting in Congress playing politics with their funding.
How can you sit here and with a straight face say the democrats are doing anything less than playing the worst kind of politics with the funding of the troops when they are tacking on demands for withdrawl, funding for thier pet interests, and things like the minimum wage increase?
It is the worst kind of politics and even the Democratic Senate leader is undermining our troops by declaring defeat while we are still fighting the war.
Your party is acting in disgrace no matter what your opinion on this war might be.
WSClark said:
The Democrats passed a spending bill to fund the troops currently fighting in Iraq. In response to the overwhelming desire of the American people, the bill provides for a timeline to end the war. It will be on his desk tomorrow.
Bush says he is going to veto the emergency appropriations bill that he requested.
Now who is playing politics?
And by the way, Nathan, WW II was waged by a Democratic CIC......
Bush says he is going to veto the emergency appropriations bill that he requested.
Now who is playing politics?
And by the way, Nathan, WW II was waged by a Democratic CIC......
Gster said:
If 2 wrongs don't make a right, what does three wrongs make? How about 4,5,7......27?????
WSClark said:
BTW - Nathan, have you heard of the Bridge to Nowhere? You might want to look it up. Senator Ted Stevens (R - Alaska) of Alaska wanted to build a $252 million bridge in Alaska to service an island of less that 50 people, so they would not have to use a ferry.
The Republicans have no room to talk about pork projects.
The Republicans have no room to talk about pork projects.
WSClark52 said:
Yeah, this president is doing a wonderful job dealing with terrorism. Here is proof.
Terror attacks worldwide rose 25 percent in ’06
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18399660/
April death toll for U.S. in Iraq passes 100
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18393279/
As I have posted before, my son is going into the military - as soon as we have a new CIC. He will not serve under a chickenhawk like Bush.
He is postpoing his life-long dream because of his personal disgust with this president.
Christ.
Terror attacks worldwide rose 25 percent in ’06
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18399660/
April death toll for U.S. in Iraq passes 100
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18393279/
As I have posted before, my son is going into the military - as soon as we have a new CIC. He will not serve under a chickenhawk like Bush.
He is postpoing his life-long dream because of his personal disgust with this president.
Christ.
Nathan said:
Not only did they do everything political they could with this money to support they troops they even timed it to make a political statement on the 4th anniversary of the Mission Accomplished statement.
How much more obvious does it have to be that this is nothing more than political crap at it's worst?
How much more obvious does it have to be that this is nothing more than political crap at it's worst?
WSClark said:
MISSION ACCOMPLISHED was political crap at it's worst. The carrier waited off-shore to 36 hours for the Bush arrival. The ship was less than thirty miles off shore, less distance than a trip to Camp David that Bush takes frequently via helicopter. The White House admitted that they had the banner made. There was absolutely no need for Bush to arrive on the deck of the carrier via fighter jet. That is political crap.
Just like George W Bush and the Plastic Turkey.
Just another photo-op that backfired.
Just like George W Bush and the Plastic Turkey.
Just another photo-op that backfired.
Nathan said:
WS Clark,
Your son needs to change his additude. No offense.
When I joined the Marines I joined under Clinton. I didn't really like Clinton at all.
Serving in the military should be about your committment to serve the Nation, not about your political bias towards the Commander in Chief.
Your son will face an entire chain of command of people who he may not always agree with, but he has no choice but to follow orders.
That is military life. It is one of Honor, Courage, and Committment.
There is never any guaruntee of who your sons or my Commander in Chief will be. We must be above that and serve proudly no matter whom may or may not be the President.
Do you think the Secret Service has the ability to choose whom they protect based on whether they like them or not?
Almost any job or endeavor your son faces in life he will be faced with people in higher places who he may not like. You have to learn how to overcome that and deal with it. Not hide from it.
No offense was meant by this, I am being honest, as a Marine who served to my best ability under both Clinton and Bush and I will continue to serve my country with the upmost dignity and honor under whomever the next President is whether the most liberal Democrat or Conservative Republican.
Your son needs to change his additude. No offense.
When I joined the Marines I joined under Clinton. I didn't really like Clinton at all.
Serving in the military should be about your committment to serve the Nation, not about your political bias towards the Commander in Chief.
Your son will face an entire chain of command of people who he may not always agree with, but he has no choice but to follow orders.
That is military life. It is one of Honor, Courage, and Committment.
There is never any guaruntee of who your sons or my Commander in Chief will be. We must be above that and serve proudly no matter whom may or may not be the President.
Do you think the Secret Service has the ability to choose whom they protect based on whether they like them or not?
Almost any job or endeavor your son faces in life he will be faced with people in higher places who he may not like. You have to learn how to overcome that and deal with it. Not hide from it.
No offense was meant by this, I am being honest, as a Marine who served to my best ability under both Clinton and Bush and I will continue to serve my country with the upmost dignity and honor under whomever the next President is whether the most liberal Democrat or Conservative Republican.
WSClark52 said:
"Your son needs to change his additude. No offense."
You have any room to criticize my son - ever. He has made a conscious decision to delay his enlistment because of GWB. I support his decision. That is called having principles.
That is much more important than any other personal characteristic.
You have any room to criticize my son - ever. He has made a conscious decision to delay his enlistment because of GWB. I support his decision. That is called having principles.
That is much more important than any other personal characteristic.
Nathan said:
I have been in the Marines for almost 10 years and served under two Presidents and several chain of commands.
I think I have a little experience to speak from in regards to the military, maybe not "room."
I think I have a little experience to speak from in regards to the military, maybe not "room."
Vaughn Tolle said:
Linked article relates to current status of Iraqi forces, and is pertinent to the discussion IMHO.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/04/30/riminton...
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/04/30/riminton...
Vaughn Tolle said:
Topic change; link below is to an executive summary of a report referenced by the Kansas Teacher of the Year on blogx. I have read it, and it makes total sense to me. Of course, since I agree with it, it is excellent. :-) I commend it to your attention.
http://www.skillscommission.org/pdf/exec_sum/Tough...
http://www.skillscommission.org/pdf/exec_sum/Tough...
Predestined said:
VT, I saw something the other day about the Kansas Teacher of the Year saying that early education (grade school) teaching should focus on the basics. The 3 R's, so to speak. I couldn't agree more. In order to "keep up with technology and the rest of the world", we've gotten away from the basic teachings and learnings of those early years. Truly, without those rock-solid basics, there's no foundation to build on. Once those basics are lost or missing, there can't be true education.
/rant
/rant
Vaughn Tolle said:
Pre, to build a bit on that; Mr. Anderson doesn't encourage the 3 Rs to the exclusion of all else. He rather believes there is a body of "core knowledge" that is critical to future success, including basic knowledge of the Arts, for example. In the short article I read, he suggests the following example: instead of memorization of the rivers in South America, the students concentrate on the importance of the rivers to the economy of South America. This is a distinction with a difference.
I also note that as a High School English teacher, he likely would encourage the acquisition of knowledge in the areas of the 3 Rs. It appears he works on his students' technical writing skills by assigning to them the task of examining new technology acquired by the school and then writing "instructions" on use thereof for the benefit of other students and faculty.
The link I posted 4/30 was from him; he says reading the report totally changed his attitudes and approach to teaching.
I also note that as a High School English teacher, he likely would encourage the acquisition of knowledge in the areas of the 3 Rs. It appears he works on his students' technical writing skills by assigning to them the task of examining new technology acquired by the school and then writing "instructions" on use thereof for the benefit of other students and faculty.
The link I posted 4/30 was from him; he says reading the report totally changed his attitudes and approach to teaching.
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